Looks like the soep kouder wordt opgegeten dan opgediend, if even managing the code share didnt work. Nice lobbying indeedtolipanebas wrote:Yes, and very soon indeed; already this autumn!
Nice lobbying from the Belgian government, BRU and SN combined.
Shows you that when they work together, they can achieve much more than just low cost riff raff.
More information on frequencies, schedule and SN code shares to come...
ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
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Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
It has nothing to do with Japan Sean. Neither with SN or ANA, and not even Belgium (at least not directly).
But who knows there already is a solution underway and interlining is no problem anyway.
But who knows there already is a solution underway and interlining is no problem anyway.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Hmm, interesting piece of information ROMAX.
My best bet: they need to be included in the Joint Venture of Lufthansa group airlines with ANA to be granted full legal immunity by the EU to work closely together as if they were one airline (similar to how they do it on the transatlantic) and such takes time: the fact ANA launched 6 months sooner than everybody expected them to may be the main reason it may or may not be ready from the start, but I highly doubt hey would have dediced to axe their CDG flight for this route to BRU if it were not to take full benefit of the potential extra feed BRU can deliver them.
Any news on whether they plan to regularly deploy the bigger 787-9 on this route, or if this will just be a one of promotional visit?
My best bet: they need to be included in the Joint Venture of Lufthansa group airlines with ANA to be granted full legal immunity by the EU to work closely together as if they were one airline (similar to how they do it on the transatlantic) and such takes time: the fact ANA launched 6 months sooner than everybody expected them to may be the main reason it may or may not be ready from the start, but I highly doubt hey would have dediced to axe their CDG flight for this route to BRU if it were not to take full benefit of the potential extra feed BRU can deliver them.
Any news on whether they plan to regularly deploy the bigger 787-9 on this route, or if this will just be a one of promotional visit?
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
The JV is another matter and a big step further than a codeshare. Also SN could codeshare on flights beyond Tokyo and ANA on flights beyond BRU and they can interline on the non-stop flight between the two hubs.
It's a very stupid regulatory thing actually. But again, last time I heard about this was some time ago shortly after the announcement of the route, I don't know if the same problem is still valid. However it is interesting that there is no word yet on a codeshare agreement so..
It's a very stupid regulatory thing actually. But again, last time I heard about this was some time ago shortly after the announcement of the route, I don't know if the same problem is still valid. However it is interesting that there is no word yet on a codeshare agreement so..
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
But there is already a code share at least on the flight's beyon Brussels.
On the site of ANA you can book flight's from multiple European city's true BRU.
On the site of ANA you can book flight's from multiple European city's true BRU.
Hasta la victoria siempre.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
As I said, there is no problem on flights beyond BRU. The only problem is the flight between BRU and Tokyo itself.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Ha ok thx
So that means that SN can not code share beyon Narita!
But that's not a big deal in any case they are star members,so for a M&M member the airline does not matter.
So that means that SN can not code share beyon Narita!
But that's not a big deal in any case they are star members,so for a M&M member the airline does not matter.
Last edited by lumumba on 19 Aug 2015, 15:17, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
For the passenger maybe not, but for SN, which gets a commission on every passenger eventually booked on an NH flight, it makes quite a difference!lumumba wrote:But that's not a big deal...
I wonder why this codeshare problem hasn't been solved yet. It should have been solved at the time of the announcement of the new flights. Or is it at the European Commission level that things are not running smoothly?
André
ex Sabena #26567
ex Sabena #26567
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
I understand that but they also fill there planes with the transit passengers to Narita.
So they make money anyway.
So they make money anyway.
Hasta la victoria siempre.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
No it is on the NRT-BRU-NRT route itself (so ANA can put its code on SN flights and SN could even puts code on ANA flights beyond NRT, but not on the NRT flight itself). It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.
Also mind that with a codeshare, passengers are counted as passengers of the airline on which code it is flying and not the operating carrier. So SN codeshare passengers on an ANA flight are in fact SN's passengers for which ANA gets paid, that's different from SN selling ANA tickets through a different sort of agreement when these are in fact ANA passengers.
Also mind that with a codeshare, passengers are counted as passengers of the airline on which code it is flying and not the operating carrier. So SN codeshare passengers on an ANA flight are in fact SN's passengers for which ANA gets paid, that's different from SN selling ANA tickets through a different sort of agreement when these are in fact ANA passengers.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Why should SN be able to put its code on Hainan flights to PEK and not on ANA flights to NRT? The routes are similar!RoMax wrote:It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.
André
ex Sabena #26567
ex Sabena #26567
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
I don't know the details, but restrictions can be route specific, can limit number of flights/routes/seats, etc. Bilateral agreements often don't apply logic anyway, they apply politics.sn26567 wrote: Why should SN be able to put its code on Hainan flights to PEK and not on ANA flights to NRT? The routes are similar!
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Of course... Russia...RoMax wrote:No it is on the NRT-BRU-NRT route itself (so ANA can put its code on SN flights and SN could even puts code on ANA flights beyond NRT, but not on the NRT flight itself). It is related to restrictive rights on overflights. Looking at the route, that should ring a bell.
Also mind that with a codeshare, passengers are counted as passengers of the airline on which code it is flying and not the operating carrier. So SN codeshare passengers on an ANA flight are in fact SN's passengers for which ANA gets paid, that's different from SN selling ANA tickets through a different sort of agreement when these are in fact ANA passengers.
Stij
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Well you can't peg it on Russia alone. They didn't start this whole mess of Ukrainain instability leading up to mutual sanctions.
Too bad that such things end up affecting seemingly unrelated airlines like SN, but I'm sure that they'll find a solution. SU has almost left the BRU-NRT low yield market as TK is too agressive on pricing and their weak Rubble doesn't allow them to compete anymore.
Too bad that such things end up affecting seemingly unrelated airlines like SN, but I'm sure that they'll find a solution. SU has almost left the BRU-NRT low yield market as TK is too agressive on pricing and their weak Rubble doesn't allow them to compete anymore.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
It's not just Ukraine and the sanctions that make Russia a difficult country. It took years before they allowed SN to operate into St Petersburg without having to compromise on other things (Moscow) and this started way before the problems with Ukraine.
Regarding Aeroflot, that's probably the best example of a fully governmental funded airline that relies on them for everything (and in exchange has to keep the Russian aircraft industry alive through orders for their own or one of their many daughter companies).
Regarding Aeroflot, that's probably the best example of a fully governmental funded airline that relies on them for everything (and in exchange has to keep the Russian aircraft industry alive through orders for their own or one of their many daughter companies).
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
SU wanted those additional daily frequencies for their day flights long before SN considered Petersburg I think. For a long time SU couldn't connect efficiently to their Asia flights from BRU. It's like an endless falling in love story I guess... But Brussels being the capital of 'hostile' EU doesn't help the situation I guess.
In my experience they can be either very accomodating or very stubborn. But I think that NH can negotiate this better as the Japanese government is very friendly with Russia at the moment.
In my experience they can be either very accomodating or very stubborn. But I think that NH can negotiate this better as the Japanese government is very friendly with Russia at the moment.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
NH upgraded my early November flight to B789 already (which has a larger Y section).
It sounds like they are positively surprised by the demand. Looking at the seatmap, it suggests that my flight's Y section would have been nearly full if operated by B788.
It sounds like they are positively surprised by the demand. Looking at the seatmap, it suggests that my flight's Y section would have been nearly full if operated by B788.
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Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
Still no news on the SN codeshare for the BRU - NRT flights?
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
I'm sorry if my question has already been answered here, but I haven't found it...
Is ANA planning daily 787-9 services or daily 787-8 services? Because of the visit of the special star wars-plane, i got al little confused.
Is ANA planning daily 787-9 services or daily 787-8 services? Because of the visit of the special star wars-plane, i got al little confused.
Re: ANA from NRT to BRU as from winter season 2015
That's very positive news, for sure.Flanker2 wrote:NH upgraded my early November flight to B789 already (which has a larger Y section).
It sounds like they are positively surprised by the demand. Looking at the seatmap, it suggests that my flight's Y section would have been nearly full if operated by B788.
If this route grows further organically over time, I wonder what the next step might be one day? 777?